After dinner tonight I asked my wife if she wanted to go checkout the Winstar casino in Oklahoma, (little less then an hour away). The casino has been there over a year and I had never been since there were no table games, until this Tuesday. We drove up and checked out what looks to be some type of tent looking building that is the casino. Once in I found it has three casinos (or at least themes). I asked where the tables were and headed that way. The first pit of tables had two pits of four tables. 3 had shuffle machines and one 6 deck shoe in each pit. The spreads were $5 to $25, and $10 to $50. I sat down at a $10-$50 table (shoe) and was even after the the first 10 hands. Then the nightmare began and it wasn't the casino, the dealer, the game, it was the players! O'my GOD! One hit a 14 vs. the dealers 5 and took the dealers bust card. After that hand he left, (Thank God or I would have). two hands later I have a $25 bet and catch 9/2 vs dealers 9, the player next to me stays on 10/5. I DD and catch a 6, the dealer flips a 4 and hit an 8. I get up, this is enough, I can handle the $.50 ante as bad as the dealers are, but the players are killers. I go to one of the other themed casinos down $70 (including the antes) and find 10 tables with $10 to $50, $25 to $100, and $50 to $200. I buy-in for $140 at the $25 to $100 shoe table. We only had four players and they knew what they were doing. I played two shoes and left with $975.00 so I have to say I liked the game since I won, but I wouldn't go there without knowing the other player at my table. I noticed a lot of attention after I placed a $70 bet and hit back to back BJ's, even more suits and security after I hit a soft 18 vs. dealers picture and caught a two to push the hand. I quit, tipped out the dealer and fiqured I made a nice little profit and needed to get my wife back home since she has to work in the morning. Will I go back up? While the dealers are new and as bad as they are, YES, but I will go with some players that know what they are doing so we can keep the idiots off the tables. Here are some of the answers to questions asked about OK BJ. 1. Yes there is an ante, $.50 is all I saw. 2. 18 is the legal age that is allowed to gamble, at least until they start serving drinks I was told. 3. The Pit Bosses are ex-Vegas and Shreveport pit critters and or dealers. 4. The dealers are "VERY WEAK"! They expose cards, pay pushes, and push losses. Some are first timers and others are ex-dealers that couldn't make it at a real casino. 5. Going form Dallas it takes about an hour to get there. When you reach Oklahoma take exit #1. 6. It is not 24/7 so call for times before heading up there. 7. No one knows when or if they are going to hold BJ tournaments (at Winstar). 8. They do have a poker room and it will open in April. 9. They will be have dice soon as well. 10. No, cocktails or beer severed at the casino, at this time.
Congrats, Txtourplayer! You managed to come out ahead on a game that is a monster to go up against! As for those who split tens and don't hit when they should....Oklahoma doens't have the market cornered on them though I saw a large number of these type players in Tulsa and Roland last weekend playing the same game you were in. I couldn't bring myself to buy into one of them. I was playing AmeriStar in KC a month or so ago and we had an Einstein sitting out our table. He had figured out that doubling on 12 against anything the dealer was showing was a profitable move. He also split all tens against anything the dealer had. About 90% he would end up pushing when splitting 10's and seemed happy about it and would proclaim that was a WIN for him. It was really sad when he walked away from the table after loosing his bank! These Einstein's are a selfcorrecting error!
Einstein What made if funny was that two tablemates of Einstein's really got hot. One got so blistered that he shoved his chair back and left. Too bad becasue there wasn't an empty seat in the house that night so he probably ended up pluggin slot machines. The other hot head jumpped up from his chair and moved over next to Einstein apparently thinking he could intimidate him into leaving the table. Didn't work. Einstein was in the throws of brilliance and was oblivious to everything going on around him. "Hot Head" lost his money before Einstein did <LOL>.
A dose of reality OK guys, how about a nice dose of reality here... Other players at the table, no matter how badly they play, don't make a bit of difference in your own results. Sometimes they'll 'take the dealer's bust card', and sometimes they'll take away the card that would have made the dealer a 21. It all evens out in the long run. This idea that bad players hurt the rest of the table is probably the most prevalent myth about the game. It shouldn't be perpetuated here. If you're wondering why you're losing, look no further than the ante. These games are unbeatable unless you backcount and only play when your advantage is large enough to overcome the ante cost. Now, there have been occasions when it is worth playing these games. For example, if they offer free tournaments occasionally that are worth more than the expected loss you incur to qualify, that's a positive EV angle. Enough of the voodoo blackjack. I'll happily let Einstein lose his money any way he wants to. It's the Einsteins out there that fund the casino's ability to pay the skilled players.
Good Medicine Well said Ken. I really find it amazing how many people believe this stuff! As if the cards finally get lined up in some predefined order and now the table is finally winning, and then someone makes a play that the rest of the table does not agree with. And guess what, the order of the cards are messed up for the next couple of shuffles. All I got to say is, it's thier money and they can play the way they want to. I've got better stuff to worry about at the tables. Dan
Lordy, that was my point Ken! It was funny because of how upset the other two guys got at "Einstein." It doesn't matter a whit what you say to those who get upset by someone elses bad play (the Einsteins), they are not going to "listen to reality" as you so aptly put it. I know a lot of you guys are very serious tournament players and hi-rollers and might not empathize with someone like me who plays nickel and dime. I am still learning and at this point in my game, flat bet and play basic strategy and look to be entertained while I play a game I am infatuated with. All of these shananigans at the tables entertain me. Note that I said I couldn't bring myself to buy into one of the Oklahoma games. It wasn't because of the poor play, but because of throwing away what for me would have been 10% of most of my bets in ante! When I'm fighting tooth and nail to find tables that will let me recover hundredths of a percentage in advantage from the house, seeing 10% flying out the window is simply horrid! Worse than 6:5 Blackjack! In Kansas City, they don't have antes. They do have "Einsteins." I've never left a table because of one of them. They are funny, and the people who go over the top because of their poor play amuse me though I think it can reflect badly on those who do know the game!
Thanks. Thanks for the update on your trip to Winstar. When I was in Miami 3 weeks ago, I could swear some of the players you were talking about were at my table too. I agree with you Ken, that it all does even out when they are making the incorrect plays. That is why I prefer to go one-on-one if at all possible and I do not see that happening in Oklahoma unless you can find a table with the limits higher in the off hours. The ante is a killer, I will be interested in finding out if and how much is returned during tournament play. My question is, will tournament play be wide open or by invitation? Wide Open, I could see a line out the door wanting to play in Miami. I think I will just stick to St. Louis for awhile, even though I do have a Tunica trip coming up in 2 weeks. Ken, does Tunica have any SD, 3:2 BlackJack or has it also gone to 6:5? Will try to find me a good DD $25 table, while my wife plays the $5 shoe with her Mother for fun and recreation. Take Care... Capt. BlackJack
Tunica is great! My mention of tournaments in Oklahoma is not based on any actual information at all. However, I assume they will have some sort of promotion to give back all the normal game winnings, as they're only allowed to profit via the ante. Hopefully, tournaments will be part of that plan. As for Tunica, it might be the best area in the country for blackjack at the moment. There are plenty of good single and double deck games. Check Fitzgerald's, the Horseshoe and the Gold Strike for some of the best.
No problems Once I noticed the the suits in and out of the pit I started talking to them first. I told them about my casino company and asked who made their tables. I told them I was making the poker tables for the casinos in Shreveport and wanted to make theirs as well. I was tipping the dealer out and kidding with the table as well. I had been putting $25 chips in my pocket to avoid having to much in front of me. I also keep under the $100 max to avoid drawing attention: "Blacks Play" or Blacks in action". However after a couple of nice win's they call "Black's out" that is when they started paying attention to our table. By the time anyone started hanging around I already had $600 in my pocket. I had worked up to $1,250, but lost a $75 DD ($150 on 7-3 & caught a 3) when the dealer made a four card 18 and then I lost $100 the next hand on (A-9) to a dealer BJ. Six Aces came up between four of us and the dealer in those two hands, I left after that. As far as BJ tournaments, if they do hold them I believe they will be open for anyone with at least an hour of play. Now those with 40 hours or more may get a free entry, but it is my understanding that all will get to play with some entry fee. I heard that was part of what the problem for pulling the tables last time.
Still Learning? Mikeaber, Still learning the game? This is a very astute observation on your part. Keep up the good work! :gun: 5:6 BJ Dan
