That is a very good point, Barney. They've been upfront about offering $100K in prizes each month, but with no details available, how much of that is going to be assigned to poker events instead of to EBJ? Ken's right again (imagine that!), this could be an excellent overlay opprtunity for wiseguy EBJ players. But, at this point, who can tell?
It's secretly hidden ;-) There is no link from the site home page, but there is one from the UBT application. When you open the application, you see a banner ad : "PRIZES Get an exclusive look! Click here!" 1- Click here! 2- Then click on "become a member today" 3- Then there are several links on the top, click on "Club Membership"
prize list (?) http://www.clububt.com/prizes.html I'm re-thinking my decision to give it a shot. Don't have an I-pod and have no use for the other merchandise products. I'll just wait and see what the layout of the cash prize events are.
Leftnut I do see the top offer is cash. Altho its a better business plan to offer prizes that the company can buy in bulk at a discount- so maybe most will be "goods" prizes. Maybe, tho, at 20 bones per month it has good entertainment value. And heck, its not bet21 :laugh: :laugh: :laugh:
Maybe FGK will play!!! Hey, FGK! Barney's right - there is no join-up bonus, so they can't screw you out of that!
With my luck My first win will get me a "Play To Win" book, first edition. Delivered from Costa Rica via pigeon! :laugh:
Clububt ev Clububt is advertising "more than $100,000 in cash prizes each month" - I interpret that as $100,001 - also advertising "1,000 tournaments" each month - that averages out to $100 per tourney - with some prize pools going up to $1,000 - according to their site - that must mean a lot of their tourneys are going to be $50 jobs - why am I not thrilled
Disagree I agree on a great deal of things you say as far as blackjack is concerned KenSmith. However, here in California gas prices are at an all time high. In fact, one of the highest in the nation and one of the most expensive places to live in not just the U.S.A., but the world. That being said, $20.00 x 12=$224.00. It's about $32.00 to fill up my tank. $224.00 divided by $32.00=7. That means I could've filled up my tank for three months. I'm just losing money. Don't get me wrong, I've been reading the forum and people are stating some 600 people at any given time are jockeying for $100.00. That's a true waste in my opinion. Sorry Ken. We will forever communicate as long as I am passionate about this game. However, I feel people need to get a clue about how stupid this really. Give me another incentive to join this club please. One thing I'm not liking about this entire online blackjack experience and tournaments across the nation is that I reside in California and this is a huge mecca for gambling. Outside of Washington and Nevada, California has more Casinos than any other states that have Casinos in the union. Yet, locally, there are only two places locally in the Southern basin that give tournaments. They are Agua Caliente Casino and The Hustler Casino down in Gardena. Let's do something for Calfiornia locally other than traveling two to three hours to Borona for the UBT buy-in of $250.00(last I checked). Lastly, oh yeah there's some things that need to be changed big time. Let's start looking at Los Angeles because you're talking about more people in this city alone than most states. Now that's revenue for you. Peace....
Actually, I would think we are better off if most of the prize pool is given out in just a few of the tournaments. That way we don't have to chain ourselves to our PCs, as if we were in some kind of BJT sweat-shop, in order to benefit from any overlay. Just play in the two or three biggest-paying tournaments each day. The size of the fields and thus the length of time it takes to complete a typical tournament might prove to be an issue, as with the current freerolls. Ken is saying that more money is likely to be given out in prizes than taken in subscriptions during the first few months. That would be just as true if the subscriptions were $200 and the prize pool $1,000,000 (more so, in fact, since it would be bound to attract fewer subscribers). The question of whether $20 per month (or c. $15, if you pay for a year up front), with no guarantee that you will recoup any of that in prizes, is too expensive to attract people with other expenses to pay, such as filling their cars with gas, is an entirely separate one. It seems to me that it is pitched about right. P.S. I wouldn't recommend moving to the UK. No tournaments whatsoever, and gas prices that would certainly get your attention! Plus I hear the weather is better in California.
Now that would work!!! A bazillion events for nickels and dimes is an annoying waste of time, but two or three events a day where getting to the final table covers your subscription for a while..... I feel your pain. Try it from southern Michigan. I'd love to dive into this pool head first, but everything seems to be so far away that it'd involve a plane ticket. Tunica, Tulsa, Laughlin, San Diego, Vegas. The only thing close was St. Ignace, still a 5 hour drive +/-, and I couldn't attend because it was a mere three days after we got back from the Palms UBT event. A snowball's chance in hell I could get away from work again that soon. :cry:
OH Kajagoogoo I hate to bring this up grab a stick lets stir:laugh: Out of my 20$ per month what is the house fee? If its 10 20 or whatever % where is my money going!!! This wondering sent an old song into my head from my party days of the 80s. I was a metal head Judas Priest Motley Crue. But, in secret I liked a song by Kajagoogoo. Dont be shy grab a stick LOLOLOL <Tongue tied or short of breath, don't even try, Try a little harder Something's wrong, I'm not naive you must be strong, ooh baby try Hey girl move a little closer You're too shy shy hush hush eye to eye Too shy shy hush hush eye to eye Too shy shy hush hush eye to eye Too shy shy hush hush hush >>
Barney, this is effectively the question which I already raised earlier in this thread. Club UBT is a different model to the usual. If the prize pool is fixed, then the effective house fee is a function of the number of subscribers. With a prize pool of $100K and a subscription price of $20 - < 5000 subscribers = overlay 5500 subscribers = 10% vig 6500 subscribers = 30% vig! etc. Those who are able to play much more frequently than most would be at an advantage, and could generate a personal overlay even if the overall situation favours the house. Conversely, those who can only find time to play occasionally would be at a disadvantage and might not be able to profit, even if there is a theoretical overlay available. All this assumes a fixed prize pool. As I mentioned earlier, it would seem to make sense to vary the prize pool each month, in line with the current membership size, holding back 10% or whatever. Clearly the initial $100K won't be sustainable for Club UBT if 5000+ subscribers can't be found, and won't be sustainable for savvy players if just a few hundred more people than that do subscribe.
My earlier comment about this being an overlay is almost certainly correct, because I don't think they'll have 5000 subscribers, at least not right away, perhaps never. However, the problem is that a big overlay on a small wager is not worth much in real dollars. ClubUBT will be for recreational players, not profiteers. Not that there's anything wrong with that of course.
But when will they change it? Quite frankly, the hook is out, the bobber is bouncing, and once they have enuf fish in the boat the bait will no longer be needed. Eventually the prizes will be scaled to fit the size of the client base. They have to do that, it is a business. Just look at the down-scaling on the UBT live events.....get the picture? Ken, it is an overlay indeed.....for now......for how long....who knows? The thing is, if you build it, and players DON'T come, can your Field of DREAMS stay in business? You can't blame UB for at least TRYING, but you CAN blame them for not PLANNING, and you MUST hold them accountable if they are not KEEPING PROMISES. OH, yeah, I am gonna channel FGK....WHERE IS MY DEPOSIT BONUS? IS IT FUNDING CLUB UBT?
Overlay Well, if it is an overlay, it certainly won't last. When did one? But it may be an overlay for now. On the other hand, how about travel expenses? That is what hurts about the so called ban on internet "gambling". Even though we do not gamble, the travel costs to engage in a contest of skill are much greater than if we could compete from home. So? Maybe I will give it a try. Maybe not. Still food for thought?
I take your point Ken. No one is going to get rich playing at Club UBT. I don't know how typical I am in my outlook, but I can't really enjoy the recreational aspects if I don't believe I have some degree of overall positive expectation. (Aside from occasionally stepping out of my league and taking on better players, which offers its own rewards - educational value and bragging rights if I get lucky). So it's only a matter of 'nickels and dimes', but still might affect whether or not I would be a long-term subscriber. It's really no different from looking at the house take in the traditional model and deciding whether it is too much. I don't play for high enough stakes for it to make much difference (in absolute dollar terms) whether the house takes 5%, 10%, or 15%, but anything above 10% probably means that each additional game I play is just another contribution to the gradual drain on my funds, whereas a smaller house fee leads me to hope that the overall flow is in the opposite direction. I don't really want to re-ignite the flames of past discussions, but I was under the impression that the relationship of UltimateBet/Bet21 to the UBT was that of a licensee. Assuming that's accurate (a big assumption, I know), then the only accountability would be for not having sufficiently slapped Bet21's wrists.
You're quite typical of someone who looks at these games with a gambler's analytical eye. A positive expected value is great and the clubUBT events will almost certainly be positive, at least for a while. But as in my earlier analysis of the current $100 freerolls, if that EV is microscopic in real dollars, a player will have to decide if the pure entertainment value makes the investment a worthwhile endeavor.
Thanks Thanks London Colin for clarification. You're pretty awesome. I just wanted to get off the subject for a second. Well, many people have asked me about my name and the origin. Well, I am a black male from Southern California(Los Angeles area) and the name is African. Yes, it's just a name and my real name. It is very unique. Pronounciation: Bye-Kim-Ba(but). Just drop the T sound at the end and you have the pronounciation. Cool kind of cat, but love the game of blackjack. Peace out. Once again, thanks for all your help London.
