I agree to your most of y'alls statements I agree that there are more players online playing poker than blackjack, I agree that they have more players making a living playing poker over playing blackjack tournaments, and I agree that luck is a big part of all gambling and tournament play. But as far as land based casinos, blackjack is still the number one table game. Game Masters even posted the number of BJ tables vs. number of poker tables in Las Vegas. Now if poker was more popular woundn't the casinos have it the other way around? I rest my case, thank you and come again...LOL
Why do poker tourney's outdraw BJ tourney's? Here in Tunica there are about 35 (5 or more per day) poker tourneys weekly and only 2 BJ tourneys. The poker events draw an average of 90 for each event while the BJ events draw about 60 each. When the WSOP circuit comes later this month the $300 events will draw 700 to 800 entries and even the $5000 event will draw about 300. Since BJ supposedly has a larger following why aren't they playing tourneys?
Poker-BJ Ya got me there. Some on this site have wondered the same about turnouts on Global. There has been much discussion of how BJ tourneys are run. It's all over the board. Most poker tourneys are run pretty much the same. Only the vig changes to protect the innocent.
99% of all poker tourneys follow PTDA rules: http://pokertda.com/. Don't you just hate it when the casino changes their format after you have spent the airfare to get there, but they say if you don't like it they will refund your entry fee.
Hey, noman. You're the one who categorically stated that poker was the most popular- now you want it to be sportsbetting? Tex: Yes, perhaps BJ is the most popular land-based game (although that's changing rapidly), but online it clearly is not; in fact cyber-poker obviously far outweighs BJ of any type, any place. By definition, "most popular" is the game in which the most people participate and if anyone cannot see that's poker (insofar as casino "table" games are concerned), you might need new glasses. But that's okay - both games keep rice in my bowl. Ya just gotta be flexible. GM
The Gamemaster I did not categorically state "poker" as the most popular. I categorically stated BJ as the most popular. Only when pokernut wanted to start providing figures from every corner of the world with self proving permutations did I introduce the new variable of sports betting. Though I also did agree, or was convinced of pokernuts' Tunica assertion. In the sample given there, there could be no arguement.
Correction Howdy. Oops! I meant to say "blackjack", not poker was your original assertion as being the most popular. Clearly that's no longer the case. GM
Observations Poker vs. Blackjack Thank you to all the people who placed their input as to poker vs. blackjack. Some of the ideas that have been put forth are interesting. Insofar as to my personal observations I think that the appeal to poker is the following: 1. It is less intimidating than BJ. What I mean by this is last weekend as a table I watched as the whole table groaned and bellyached when my wife didn’t hit a 16 vs. a dealer 10. I was trying to teach her the game and in this case the count was +5 (running not true). The dealer wound up breaking but after that she didn’t want to play anymore and was really intimidated. 2. For a small buy-in you can really play poker for a long time. That is if you consider passing on most hands unless you’ve got a pair or a King or Ace as one of your cards (Don’t rag on me about this – I never claimed to be a poker player) 3. The potential for payoffs is much higher – percentage wise. (Buy-in for 20 and the top people all win 200+ 4. Easier on the mind – Once a hand is “flopped” there is a new shuffle and those cards don’t influence the remainder of the “shoe” I think that strategy in poker is/can be similar to BJ but I don’t have the time to learn the nuances. I’m an obsessive/compulsive personality and TBJ is on my radar screen right now. As far as casino’s BJ is the way over the top winner. In AC there are many many more BJ tables than poker tables. Just my .02 PS - I don't want to hear s... about not teaching the Mrs. basic strategy I DON'T want to sleep on the couch. PSS - From her initial 100 buy in she cashed out 325 in 60 minutes play - then she made me play at the slots with HER! ARRRRRRRRRRRRR:flame:
Gamemaster: My opps Too. I attributed the skewed statistics to pokernut, cause he made a good Tunica case. The skewed statistics were yours. and i'm not ready to conceed the point just yet. Cause to repeat, I brought in SPorts Betting, cause if you're going to throw in on line numbers, then Sports Betting is the winner. As to 32,000 or such people on say Party Poker or Poker Stars or all on line sites, look at the games and the stakes. Look to the multiple game players. While a BJ player in person can play two or more spots. He usually can't play two tables at the same time. In addition to table numbers: Left out were Wendover, Winamucca, Elko, Battle Mountain, Sparks, Reno and Verdi and all the smaller towns in between Don't forget Laughlin and State Line. North and South Dakota too. Iowa just added BJ. Illinois and Indiana Boats. Shreveport and the Gulf Coast in addition to Tunica. Now, I've played poker at Foxwoods,(Mohegan didn't have it then) and while Foxwoods poker room is large, they have at least eight other rooms of bj that are larger. And for the four days I was there, while the poker room was crowded and had a waiting list. The BJ tables were full. While one could play a 2-4 ring game in poker, the min at BJ was 25. I've played poker at Hard Rock and Seminole in Hollywood Fla. NO BJ there. But other than Fri and Sat nights, the poker rooms weren't crowded and the limits were 2-4 or straight 2. I've played poker at the Plaza, Binions, Sahara, Stardust, Harah's, Rio, Gold Coast, Psalms and The Bellagio. And probably a couple others I can't remember. Of the vegas locations, of course Bellagio's room was the biggest and had a waiting list most of the time. The Psalms had or has two rooms, small at best and crowded with a waiting list. But other than the Psalms and Bellagio of my list, come 2am to noon, most of the poker rooms are bare, but for maybe one table of maybe ten. Yet the BJ tables, even reduced in number for the graveyard shift are booming. Certainly poker has the appeal for the big bucks. And on line its easy to try and to play. But you can't compare legions of people trying at .05-.10 blinds, with the numbers of people who have to have a $15 min., unless there maybe down in Searchlight. That's why I say if you want to bring in on line numbers you have to bring in on-line sports betting and add it to all the other sports betting that goes on. Sports betting given all that would be the most popular.(Popular in terms of money and individuals participating.) Till every casino reverses the number of poker tables with bj tables then you might have a start.
Interesting.... Hey, noman, The topic is Poker versus BJ and you now want sportsbetting to be included? Come now....let's stick to the topic. Wendover & Winnemucca have 130 BJ tables; Laughlin has 170 and Reno has 300. I think those were safely included in my "double" for AC and CT. And I just gave the numbers for 1 online poker site - throw in the others and you can count all of the BJ tables in North and South America and it's no contest. I especially like how you "quantify" this by the size of the bet. Be they betting $.01 or $1000, they're playing poker. And, while your personal experiences are interesting and illuminating, in the grand scheme they mean nothing. Poker is far, far more popular than BJ; accept it. GM
Here is a monkey wrench for this argument. Do you think the carnival poker games should be counted as poker? While in the casinos last week I noticed during peak hours the poker carnival games were cranking. B
Well what an interesting development. People have been debating what is more popular poker vs. BJ. It's neat to read that. However my main intent was to have poker people tell me what the fascination was with THAT game. I recently noted that on Friday night the 20.00 EBJ on Bet21.com was changed to 1.00. I e-mailed CS and asked why. The response was that basically due to marketing and demand they decided to change it. Hmmmmmmmmmmmm Could it be that poker players are cheap? No before you get all angry and upset I'm just asking why they did this? I've also notice that there are a lot "less" poker players playing EBJ lately. In fact this morning a poker player (PokerQueen) was chatting and complaining that "...this BJ is rigged" When questioned why she said that whenever the dealer had a 6 as an upcard they were supposed to bust but the dealer on Bet21.com always drew to 20 or 21! I chatted back that I felt Texas Hold Em was rigged because everytime I got a pair the flop was rigged against me! [I was only joking - but she didn't take it that way] I guess these poker players get upset when losing their $ in less than the 5-6 hours it takes for their poker tourney's right?
I feel there is far more Luck in BJ, it does take skill to determine your bet size but from there on it is the luck of the cards. With Poker you do not always have to catch the cards as in BJ, but you can still win without the right cards by making your opponent think you have caught them. And with BJ how many times do you have your entire buy-in at risk on one hand. Online poker players seem to be cheap as there very few large tourneys online compared to $5-10 buy-ins, but each week my tourney entry fees average between $500-$600 in weekly tourneys here in Tunica. I don't like online play for Bj or poker and I can see no reason to play online when I have live action. But I do love having online poker players sit at my table as most are great donks (fish).
Pokernut, Probably one of the best "rationales" to explain the attraction of poker. Thanks. With regard to luck - hmmm Maybe you and Joep should have THAT discussion :laugh:
